During the Venice Film Festival, Universal Film & Television Journal’s Amir Ganjavie interviewed Yohann Comte, one of the co-founders of Charades an international sales and distribution company.
Amir Ganjavie, UniversalCinema Magazine (UM): Can you tell us a little about your role and the company?
Yohann Comte (YC): As a co-founder, I oversee a bit of everything, but between the founding partners, I’m the one in charge of Japan, Italy, Spain, and Germany. Carole Baraton does the English-speaking territories and Scandinavia. And, our third partner Pierre Mazars, doing the, Eastern Europe, Middle East, Turkey, and Israel. The rest of the world is handling by two other sales agents.
(UM): What kind of movies are you looking for?
(YC): We have a really wide variety of films. We have a black and white film from Germany in competition at Venice this year, but we also have a lot of other films, like genre films in the “Midnight Madness” section. We do a lot of animation, too. I would say, the common thread is that 80% of the line-up is first or second-time directors.
(UM): Do you have an example of a good movie, the kind you are looking for?
(YC): I think I’m happy with films that make distributors happy. When we’re selling to distributors, sometimes you resell or sell films at a very high price but it doesn’t perform and allow the distributor to recoup their investment. That doesn’t make us happy. The type of film we prefer is first of all discovering new voices, like we did “Aftersun” last year, in which Paul Mescal was nominated for an Oscar. We did “I Lost My Body“, which won Critics’ Week. It was nominated for Best Animated Feature at the Academy Awards too. Discovering new voices is the most exciting part. And business-wise, it’s making distributors happy because if they make money, we make money.
(UM): How important are festivals to you when selecting films?
(YC): Absolutely necessary, but sometimes not sufficient. I think there’s a need for an International Film Festival just to raise awareness among the distributors because there are so many films on the market. The fact that they are selected here (Venice, for example), means they are the best of the best. This means that they’re more likely to be press pleasers, and if you don’t have a known cast, you need the support of the press.
(UM): And with the democratization of cinema, more films are being produced, but it makes it harder to distribute them all. It seems to be easier for films with known actors or directors.
(YC): Yes, that’s true. But, there’s always space for surprises. Of course, some distributors want to go for the obvious, but repeating the same recipe makes an audience tired of going to the cinema. There needs to be a moment for surprises. Of course, you cannot base a business on exceptions, but with films like Drive My Car, Parasite, or Aftersun, there is space for a new proposal. It’s hard to define because what’s average in one country, is the most ambitious in another one.
(UM): So, it’s very different.
(YC): But there are indeed too many average films.
(UM): Aftersun did very well, is being able to pick movies like that something that comes with experience, knowing what kind of movies will sell?
(YC): It was probably a bit clearer before the pandemic, and then the pandemic has reshuffled all the cards. When it came to foreign audiences, it was an elderly educated audience, and that audience has not come back fully to the cinemas after the pandemic. Now, everybody’s focusing on theatrical again and bringing people back to the theatre. So, finding films like Aftersun, which brought back a younger audience to the cinema. But Aftersun was unpredictable, and Parasite was very unpredictable as well. That’s the beauty of what we do. I can anticipate the absence of a downside on a certain type of film, like CGI family animation, and that genre films will always sell. Most genre films sell because they don’t necessarily need theatrical releases and the market is not strangely overflooded with genre films. But, when it comes to the festival films, that’s really difficult to know.
(UM): And you mentioned CGI. That sells well too?
(YC): Yes, always. Probably, because it’s much harder to produce than live-action. You cannot do a cheap animation film.
(UM): I heard that in terms of going to festivals, even when they are big, they don’t always help in terms of sales.
(YC): That’s true. There are always a few films that do not benefit enough from the festival. It happens that you have the one film that everybody likes, but in the end, it doesn’t get any price. In every major festival, there are always two or three films in the selection that don’t make the cut or don’t sell great. But you cannot dream of better exposure. That’s what I say a festival is absolutely necessary but sometimes not sufficient.
(UM): And in terms of theatrical run or streaming after the festival do you have a preference?
(YC): No. With some movies, we’re going straight to VOD, it doesn’t make sense to do a theatrical release. It’s not just about the money spent, it’s all the resources and the time dedicated to releasing the film, to do 10,000 admissions. Sometimes the film makes more sense to go straight to VOD, and this is where festivals are even more important. We are in Venice, but there are also a lot of smaller local genre festivals that are watched by the genre community. the Japanese animation community, etc. And those will help promote the film and you will strike a VOD deal as a result.
(UM): And how are you selecting the films? Do the filmmakers submit them to you? The producers?
(YC): The producers. Sometimes, we co-produce if it’s necessary. Meaning, we like to be involved. We are international distributors but sometimes to sell a film you need to make it happen. So, sometimes, we end up co-producing so that the film gets made.
(UM): And are you working with a specific producer or—
(YC): Anybody. Absolutely anybody. What we realized over six years of existence, most of the time, we work a lot with young, first or second-time directors. But they usually work with an experienced producer. Having a first-time producer and first-time director makes it more challenging for us in terms of ambition. Because the producer is also talent. And, these are the talents that we’re were targeting.
(UM): I had a conversation with another distributor and she said that right now Netflix isn’t beneficial to go for movie events because there is too much content and it gets lost.
(YC): I mean we had a great experience when we were doing this animated feature film for adults, I Lost My Body. The best chance for the film, at the time, was to go on Netflix, because they were also guaranteeing an Oscar campaign that would make the film shine in the whole world. So, that can make sense, but I think it’s more Netflix being less interested in festival films than they used to be and being more focused on their own production. But, for some films, Netflix is the best opportunity.
(UM): And in terms of ratios do you have any that you are looking for in gender or geographics when selecting films?
(YC): Not on purpose. We have absolutely no criteria, but looking back it happens to be 50/50 male and female directors and a lot of young filmmakers.
(UM): And usually how many movies are you selecting?
(YC): 15.
(UM): And what service do you provide the films you select?
(YC): The sales, but the sales don’t represent the biggest part of the time. Most of the time, when it comes to distribution, there’s the coordination of the different releases, delivering every territory with the material, and approving the marketing campaigns. The more marketing elements, and assets, we can provide to the distributor, the happier they are. So we often try to create content that inspires and provides ideas for the distributor on how to promote the film and engage with the audience.We also ensure, in collaboration with producers and agents, the availability of talent, which is always helpful for the film’s promotion.
(UM): I’ve talked to a few directors and they told me that after all the costs involved, they didn’t receive much money after giving their film to an international distributor.
(YC): But, the point is, that whatever there is a minimum commitment that you need to do. Meaning, that whether you’re going to do, two hundred thousand euros of sales or two million, usually you’re going to have to spend a certain amount of money to be at every market, creating a poster or some teaser, which is a long trailer. So, you have immediate costs. And then if the film sells for one hundred instead of more, they might not see any money. If I don’t do anything, there’s rarely a chance that it might sell. I wish we could predict the numbers, but the only commitment we can make is that we’re going to spend energy, we’re going to spend money to try to make it work.
And, that’s probably the problem, because for some films, it’s great if they do eighty thousand euros in sales, but if you spend eighty or even if you spend fifty trying to promote it. If you want to screen it in Berlin, Cannes, and the American film market, you have already ten thousand for screenings. And, then you add that to the cost of renting a booth, or standard flying, housing for the sales team. That money goes quickly.
(UM): And in terms of festivals are there any kinds of priority?
(YC): I mean, the festivals like Berlin, Cannes, Venice, Toronto, and a few others, that they have global reach. In one presentation, you have the whole world. All the distributors are looking at it. When that doesn’t happen, you go from one regional festival to another, because, all those major festivals, and they are asking for worldwide exclusivity. If you don’t have it, you can go do several regional festivals. Let’s say you get the Asian Premiere, the European Premiere, and then you get, like, the reach within the continent. And, then, if you don’t get those, you go country-by-country.
(UM): And, you mentioned that you have three co-founders that were working in different regions. Is there any kind of a big difference between these three regions in terms of sales strategies?
(YC): We do a campaign for the whole world. But there are different ways of doing business depending on the country. But the contracts are pretty much the same.
(UM): And, in terms of introducing your films to the festivals, how you are trying to approach the distributors or festival organizers?
(YC): Oh, you meet them throughout the year. And then, often from the moment it’s happening, they are super busy. So, you just get a text or phone call if they love the film. You can discuss the film with a festival programmer if they like it. People think that depending on that sales agent, they can turn the festival around and force a selection of films the festival didn’t like, but it’s not happening. The festival programmers are already turning down a lot of things that they love. Most of the discussion we’re going to have is if they like a film, then, they’re like, “Okay. I’m thinking about it.”, “I loved it.”, “I’m thinking about this for this section. And then this is for another…” So, that’s the kind of discussion we have but it can stop six months before. For instance, you can show films to Berlin as early as the summer, or Venice would start screening films that could be in Cannes because then, the sales are generally, pretty sure. Like, if I’m in this section in Cannes, maybe, we can have competition in Venice. They kind of use the competition.
(UM): And, I imagine you spend a lot of time making yourself familiar with the taste of festivals, with the people in charge?
(YC): Not enough. We’re trying to. There’s so much to do all the time. I think the festivals (not the specialized/genre festivals) are opening slowly to animation, and are totally open to genre films, like, Titan. So, I think they, more or less, all want the same, the best directors.
(UM): I’ve noticed that talking with some festival programmers, it seems to be a kind of temporary job.
(YC): Not Venice and Cannes where they are the bosses of the main competitions. But, there’s a lot of pressure on those people. It’s a really tough job. That’s why, there are a lot of turnarounds.
(UM): And have you noticed any shifts in the business over the years?
(YC): Well, COVID changed a lot. I mean, I started 15 years ago, and everybody was always complaining that it was easier, better than before so I’ve grown up hearing that all the time. It’s true. I’d say there’s more selection and more polarization on certain films. There used to be a time when you could always find a way to sell and today it can be all or nothing.
(UM): Anything else you’d like to add?
(YC): Sometimes because of the rules within a festival exclusivity prevails over quality. For instance, if I have one thing in one festival in Asia, then I couldn’t have it play in another festival, because they would rather take something that hasn’t played in another region rather than a great film that already played somewhere else in the region. This makes our job difficult, because, sometimes, you cannot exist just for one festival.
For instance, imagine the press. They screen all the films in competition but don’t have time to cover some minor sections because there’s too much happening. So, this is fine for certain films, because the best ones will travel to all festivals. But the ones that are a bit less strong or from less known directors sometimes suffer from this stress of exclusivity.
(UM): Some distributors told me, that the problem is that other festivals are looking at big festivals like Toronto, Cannes, Berlin, and Venice and they always pick movies from them.
(YC): Yeah. This is a bit sad, because those movies, if they are in competition, don’t need so many of the other features (press coverage). Audiences will hear about them, they should probably be the non-competitive sections, for instance, to give some space to others to get press. But, that’s a tough decision to make; how to organize.
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