During the Red Sea International Film Festival (Red Sea IFF) Universal Cinema Film & TV Journal’s Amir Ganjavie interviewed Emad Z. Eskander the Head of Red Sea Fund, the funding arm for filmmakers from the Red Sea Film Foundation. What follows are the highlights of that interview.
Amir Ganjavie, UniversalCinema Magazine (UM): Can you speak about what kinds of films you are trying to support, and at what stage you get involved? Is it during development, post-production…
Emad Z. Eskander (EZE): We have the old three-support system. It’s development, production, and post-production. We support all formats, series, narrative features, documentaries, docuseries, and short films. But short films are the only ones exclusive to the Saudis because we want the local people. After all, comparatively, it’s a relatively young industry so we are leaving the shorts just for the locals to experiment with.
(UM): And do you have any criteria you’re looking for?
(EZE): A lot of people don’t say this. But trust me when I say that we’re just looking for good films. We don’t have agendas. We don’t run after certain topics. A good film is a good film. Our only eligibility criteria are not topics as much as people. The support, the Red Sea Fund is supporting the whole of Africa. And of the Arab world, and, obviously, mainly Saudi Arabia. So Saudi Arabia, the Arab world, and the whole of Africa. We are planning to open to Asia. But currently, for eligibility, the director has to be Arab in Origin or Arab National. Or if it’s an African director, it has to be an African National director. Then we would support it if it’s a good idea.
(UM): Okay. So, for example, when you’re supporting the Johnny Depp movies at Cannes, is it because of the directors and her tie with Algeria? Or how does that work? Because I see support many international films.
(EZE): Well, that is a different division. We are going to announce it with the Red Sea Film Foundation. It’s a different division that aims for these kinds of A-list. I wouldn’t call it A-level projects because even the funds that we’ve been funding, took a lot of awards. But I mean, these big projects, come with different objectives that the foundation wants to serve. And it’s a completely different division. So mainly that’s the thing. We supported Ferrari, and now a new Guy Richie film is coming. It’s a different division. It’s a different thing.
(UM): And is the fund annual or in a cycle?
(EZE): We have four cycles. Four windows throughout the year. We start on the 6th of Feb. We start with post-production. On average, we give somewhere from $40,000 to $90,000 on post-production. Then two months later, on the 6th of April, we usually start with the development, but we are planning, though it won’t be finalized until the end of December, to do production first. So, on the 6th of April, production opens, on June 6th development opens, and then on August 6th, we go through another round of post-production.
(UM): And for production, what’s the maximum you approve?
(EZE): For production, it’s somewhere from $90,000 to $140,000. But if it’s an exceptional project, we call it VIP support, we give it $500,000. And for development, development, for features, we go from $25,000. If it’s an animation, it goes to 35,000 bucks.
(UM): And what do you want in return when you are investing in a film?
(EZE): Most of what we do is grants. Any dollar below $150,000 is a grant. What we want is for them to have our logo, hopefully, go to festivals, and hopefully win awards. It’s mainly about having our support showing through for the sake of our awareness. And second thing, we ask for the MENA region. We ask at least for a Premiere of the MENA region. We are proud when you go to one of those A-list film festivals around the world Berlin, Cannes, obviously TIFF, Venice, we support you while you go there. But we ask for the MENA Premiere.
(UM): And when you are saying that you are supporting filmmakers, do you mean that you are also negotiating for filmmakers to get into the A-list festivals? Are you rewarding their films?
(EZE): We started doing that, especially with the Saudi projects because, to be honest, if you see the Arab world in Africa, there’s a lot of experienced producers and directors that are attached to these projects. Whereas Saudis, we are relatively young [filmmakers]. But we are starting big. You’ve seen the Saudi films this year; they’re really good. And it’s unbelievable to see the house full, like a thousand-seater, and it’s a full house for all Saudi projects. This is beautiful. So, we mainly help the Saudis to become that, applying to the A-list festivals, because other projects have more experienced producers who know how to get into Cannes, TIFF, etc.
(UM): And when you are, for example, saying that I’m supporting an Arabian filmmaker, do you mean that country of his birth, for example, can filmmaker live in another country, but he was born in Saudi Arabia, would you consider him a Saudi Arabian filmmaker for the fund?
(EZE): Most definitely. If you’re Saudi or born in Saudi, we consider you Saudi, and a Saudi project.
(UM): And do you have any kind of quotas in terms of race or gender in the selection process?
(EZE): A good film, a good idea, a good story is a good story. Regardless of who you are, or where you come from.
(UM): So, you are not looking for example, female, or feminist kinds of projects or feminist-driven films?
(EZE): It’s not about any ism as much as if it’s a good story. If the filmmaker, actually wants a voice to say this message, not just being part of a trend, because our committee members and readers are practicing filmmakers and they see through this. If it’s a legit story, a legit voice, and the director actually wants to talk about this, we work with it.
(UM): And what is the best way for filmmakers to submit a project? Do you, for example, recommend they first contact you after introducing the project? Or do you want them to directly submit the project? I see that some fund organizations provide consultation, for example.
(EZE): If we meet at any of the festivals or panels, we can talk, but mainly for the cycle. Because what we ask for, any filmmaker knows. We don’t ask for much. Usually, we ask for the dossier, the pitch deck, and a director’s statement about why they want to do the project. It can be one minute; it can be 30 seconds. We don’t ask for something exceptionally different.
(UM): I was at the opening, and I heard that almost 250 projects were funded by the Red Sea Fund. How did you come to that number?
(EZE): Yes, 200 in the last three years. If you collect them all, around 242 projects. if I’m being too specific were funded films from across Africa, from the Arab World, and Saudi Arabia.
(UM): And percentage-wise, how many of them were from Saudi Arabia? How many of them are from the Arab World?
(EZE): I wish I could pull up my laptop and give you accurate numbers, but I’ll go off my head. A big chunk is the Arab world because of the experienced directors, I would say easily 40%. Even a bit more. They’re around 55%/60% Arab World excluding Saudi Arabia. 20% is Saudi Arabia and 20% is Africa. And again, natural selection we put allocations for every region to make sure we can support as much. But this is natural selection. A good film is a good film.
(UM): And as a filmmaker, I realize that right now the biggest challenge with filmmaking is distribution issues. It’s become cheaper to make films with the democratization of the digital camera but this has made distribution the more difficult or challenging part. Sometimes you cannot find any good distribution. I’m just curious, do you have any kind of a strategy to help the films you fund in terms of distribution?
(EZE): Most definitely, especially the local ones. Even the Arab World films need a push in distribution. We have a local distributor, a company called CineWaves. They’re doing a great job led by Faisal Baltyuor, a good friend and a great filmmaker. In addition, we have news related to distribution that we will be announcing on our foundation website soon, so keep a lookout.
(UM): I see there are around 400 million Arabs all around the globe. It’s a very huge population and we don’t see too much film attention to this in the past. I’m curious if you have any words about distribution, production in the Arab World and the vision that we have for making films.
(EZE): In my completely humble opinion. I would say, that the independent scene almost suffers from this everywhere. No matter where you go, the more established the mainstream is, the more the independent, in a way, suffers. But again, this is where the festival comes in. This is what good producers if attached to the project. And advice I would give to these independent filmmakers is that I believe we need to think about the commercial value. We need to think about the mass effect. And I’m not talking about, we’re not going to even argue artistic versus commercial films. Both of them exist. The existence of both is important. And they complement each other. But I believe there’s a sweet spot. It’s good for the filmmaker to make money in the artist’s way.
(UM): What is very interesting for me here is the freedom that exists in the characters in the films we see. We can see all kinds of religions and sexualities openly discussed and represented. In terms of funding, is there any content, like extreme violence or language that you would not fund?
(EZE): No, there are no restrictions. Again, a good story is a good story. I wouldn’t call the restriction, but some films are violent just for the sake of being violent, sexual just for the sake of being sexual, these are the films that we’re unlikely to support. Our selection panel is good enough to spot this. But if it complements the story, we support everything.
(UM): I see that this year compared to the previous year, there are more local people in the theaters. Saudi people coming, enjoying movies, which is great. What strategy are you using to get people into the cinema, which had no tradition in the past?
(EZE): The audience is growing because the audience knows the expectations. I’m glad to see the Saudi audience evolving fast, to be honest. In 2021, when they used to go to a short film or independent film, they’re like, huh? Did the film just end? What was the message? What’s going on? Why is the actor not talking? Because independent films are very artistic in that sense. But the audiences are growing, they’re now understanding what it is, and not just understanding they’re enjoying it. They see the effect of it. The impact they have after leaving the theater, they still have the movies in their head. And I love this, but there’s much more to do. We need to build the audience even more. Red Sea is doing a lot as a foundation to tackle this.
We are an ecosystem. The festival is at the end of the year. But during the year, we have programs like the Red Sea Fund, which I’m heading, that goes throughout the year. And then there is this great program, the Red Sea Labs, which is the education part, and they have so many programs run by Ryan Ashore. Man, I cannot talk about the labs as much as it deserves. It started as one program, the lodge, and even that one program (done was great with Torino Film Lab). And now they have nine programs.
And the fund and the labs are very close in that we bring insights from the Saudi market and they do the labs that complement. For example, a highlight from this year, we noticed that 99 point something of Saudi films think about music, filming cinematic music, and music and films in post-production. We shared these numbers with the labs and we designed a program called Music and Films where we brought local composers or people who have the potential to be composers and brought international composers to sit with them and tell them how to do this. It’s not just the music part. How to talk to a director. In filmmaking, you have to dance with your composer. It’s a creative process. It’s not just, “I want Hip Hop.” It goes deeper, the relationship between a music composer and a director. And we’re trying to build that. This is just one of the examples that we’re doing.
I can mention a lot of projects, but one of them that comes to my mind is Dancing on Fire, a Saudi project that came to the fund in 2021 and got rejected. It went to the labs in 2022, came out as a great project, and then got funded by us. Now it’s the project is in the market in the Souk. And once it’s done, it’s going to be premiered at the Red Sea IFF. You can see the ecosystem we’re trying to build.
(UM): My last question, when I was discussing with friends, all of them were amazed by what you have done here. We hope that nothing like what happened with the Dubai International Film Festival (which stopped running after 2019) happens here. Have you thought about this and how to avoid it?
(EZE): Most definitely. I wish this question was asked of our CEO or our Managing Director because they’re the visionaries who made a lot of things happen. But from our side, because I’m not personally aware of the Dubai Film Festival’s history, but I’ve heard a lot. A lot of festivals go boom, and then they go down. I believe what will make Saudi different, is our own Saudi film industry is strong. Nothing against any country, a lot of festivals go down for many reasons, but we have a strong local presence from technical crew to filmmaking. Other than that, the government is providing some good support. At the same time, the government is aiming for us to at some point fund our programs. We are aiming point to be a self-funded non-profit organization.
(UM): That’s great. At the end of our conversation, is there anything else you’d like to add?
(EZE): Yeah, I would just ask the filmmakers who want to apply to our fund, don’t think agendas, don’t think that we run after a certain topic. Be a great filmmaker. Give us something you actually want to say, that you actually want to talk about. It doesn’t have to be preachy, it doesn’t have to be moral, as you feel it and you know what you want to say as a filmmaker. Trust me, we have that good panel that can see through this. And we would love to support 242 more films.
I hope we do another interview the day we have 2,400 films supported.
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